EXCLUSIVE BREAKING. (Click on image to enlarge). As The Lakewood Scoop reported here on Monday, May 18, our reliable sources on both sides of the Bais Faiga controversy report that significant issues still separate the parties, despite the fact that some progress has been made. The Lakewood Scoop promised to keep our readers posted of developments, so we dug a little deeper, and discovered the specific issues still separating the parties. As of now, there are 14 issues in contention. These are listed in a document entitled "Talking Points", which is reproduced exactly, (all mistakes are in the original document). (TLS).
Wednesday, May 20, 2009
BREAKING NEWS Bais Faiga Update
EXCLUSIVE BREAKING. (Click on image to enlarge). As The Lakewood Scoop reported here on Monday, May 18, our reliable sources on both sides of the Bais Faiga controversy report that significant issues still separate the parties, despite the fact that some progress has been made. The Lakewood Scoop promised to keep our readers posted of developments, so we dug a little deeper, and discovered the specific issues still separating the parties. As of now, there are 14 issues in contention. These are listed in a document entitled "Talking Points", which is reproduced exactly, (all mistakes are in the original document). (TLS).
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63 comments:
I hope I can get my kids into another school fast!
In #7 - I think they are putting themselves at risk by having an even number. How about each side agreeing on one more person this way there is no risk of a tie?
Other than that it seems very reasonable.
Who wrote this up?
After I saw this, think Im gonna start home schooling.
this makes you nauseous .
Am I the only one annoyed by the fact that no parents were consulted. Perhaps we would like some changes in the school that affect our children directly. I'm glad everyones kovod is intact. but our children were overlooked and disregarded. Why don't WE get to vote whos on the vaad.I proclaim NO TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION (No tuition) History repeats itself -that motto started the American Revolution And it will start the Bais Faiga/Cheder revolution!
wow.. tls.. how'd you get this? Did BMG leave the offices unlocked to go to the tent event and you snuck in??
If this is all the contention why can they not work it out in a day?
My point of contention is why is the Menaheles left with all the power. Who is on top of her? Do we call R' Malkiel every time we have a problem
Interesting! Will this have an impact on tonights event- I hope the proper kavod hatorah will be displayed
Mkadesh shem shmayim!!
Dont the parents have a say on whos on the VAAD???!!!!
interesting which comments u leave out!
NO one has to be ontop of anybody as long as the people in charge have the trust of thre Roshei yeshiva and parents that should be enough this is not a system of checks and balances If the Menaheles is trusted why does she need someone on top same for the Menahalim
its when things need change and someone is not living upto or doing their job that someone come in and fix it but otherwise let evreyone do their jobs amd yes who else besides the Roshei yeshiva and rabbanim should have a say in theses things.
what is the problem everything should be up to the the main Rosh Hayeshiva Rav Malkiel . They started the cheder and without the yeshiva there would be no cheder. Rav Malkiel has only the childrens interest.
if anyone does not like it GO LEAVE LAKEWOOD !!!!
The problem is not the Rosh Yeshiva its who he associates himself with
they DID NOT START THE CHEDER. reb shneur opposed it's creation, did not send his kids there, and when he tried to switch ak there from bezalel they wouldn't take him. he couldn't even get his own kids in to it. the charter is very clear - yeshiva had nothing to do with it, is a nonentity. there's even a signed piece of paper guarded like the crown jewels after reb shneur tried to convince them to retain someone in employment that they didn't want and there was a whole maaseh and in fact reb shneur signed that he has no baalus (de ja vu????) i personally called up some of the people that started the cheder and asked them and they aid clearly that reb shneur HAD NO INVOLVEMENT
I think all involved should be ashamed of the Chilul Hashem and Sinas Chinam they have caused.
the yeshiva has no intrest in the cheder at all.The RY Rav Malkiel has an achrayus for the chinuch habanim vehabanos of lakewood and if he feels it necessary to fix things we should not interfer.there are plenty of askanim and power brokers who are well intentioned (not all)who feel that they should be the ones making the desicions but guess what Boruch hashem we have roshei yeshiva who can lead us in the right direction what the askanim should do is help the RY make it easier for them support them not fight them and only destruct.
I hope they reserve Bais faiga for an asifa ASAP, before this "deal" falls apart!
I am ashamed of the fighting. People can disagree in a professional way, but to fight like babies is a chillul HaShem.
I believe the people posting the positive blogs do not have their children in the school or they would see the clear need for a system of checks and balances.Dont you think its a conflict of interest for one of the vaad hachinuch members wife to be the assistant principal. who do you think he will stick up for the parents/children or his wife.
If the olim isnt happy with the way the rosh yeshiva is handling the situation show your protest by not attending tonights event.
"If the olim isnt happy with the way the rosh yeshiva is handling the situation show your protest by not attending tonights event."
I'm going for supper and giving my wife a break. Like they say BMG is always there for you...
the chilul hashem of posting this issue on the internet is a chilul hashem. period.
To all those parants who are involved did u pay ur tuition at least to the side ur on ????? NO U DIDN'T ....... So stop !! At least pay the teacher. And if u not happy take ur kid somewhere else (if u can get in)
One of the names on the Vaad "Hakaspi" boggles the mind!!
Maybe one can deduct the amount owed to them by this individual on the vaad hakaspi from their tuition. Agav nowadays nothing boggles the mind.
Anonymous said...
To all those parants who are involved did u pay ur tuition at least to the side ur on ????? NO U DIDN'T .......
NO we didn't
did you read the comment no taxation without representation
we will not pay blindly while decisions are being made against our will.
I wil like to remain anonymous so please dont post my name,
i have some inside info.
i hope this all ends quikly
Finally the truth comes out. Loud and clear.
This was never about RBM, Mrs. E. the land, or the debts.
It was simply about who owns and controls LCS and BF. The parents or the yeshiva.
RBM had to go, because he stood in the way of a hostile takeover.
What a sham(e).
since I can't read that page on my PDA can someone tell me the names in the vaad
Hey big shots! - you want a say...(other then on a blog)? Put your (full/half/third?) tuition in escrow. Don't shy away from your responsabilities.
There are very few naive people left in Lakewood who still think that BMG is in it for the correct chinuch of our children.
This drafted letter (written by Y.M., M.G. and S.Z.R.) was catered to fit the needs of BMG, and is indicative of what the machlokes was truly about the whole time.
Its all about one thing - power and control.
no pics yet from the tent party!?!?!?!
Now that BMG is back in control, they should rehire RBM , thats probably the only thing that can save this school from not falling apart.
whos going to cover the payroll every fri?
which one of the VAAD members? they will grow tired of it very quickly
Talking point #1: If they are independent Vaadim, how can they run a Mossad? Chinuch and money decisions are dependent on each other, as the author of this paper states himself in TP #3.
TP#3: Certain decisions obviously belong to the principal. VAGUE! If it so obvious, why not let us know what they are? And NONSENSE! A principal is allowed to make decisions only as guided by the Vaad(im). And I am exercising self-control by not mentioning any recent decisions of principals that brought about this whole machloikis.
TP#6: By the use of the word "our", the author is obviously trying to chanfa Rav Malkiel. This is even more evident in the nausiating TP#8.
TP#7: The funniest Talking Point of all. There is an even number "bedavka" so there should be trust and faith and sholom. "Since we trust that everyone's goal is the same, there will always be a majority". He spent 8 lines explaining that he expects every decision to be a deadlock. Yeah, this will bring trust and faith and sholom. But wait until TP#9!
TP#8: This TP speaks for itself.
TP#9: What are Y, M and SZ afraid of? And this will bring about a feeling of TRUST and ACHDUS????
TP#10: There is a fallacy that claims that BF tuition subsidizes the Cheder. The truth is that BF tuition goes mainly to pay for the two buildings (and each one is really a double building, with a new wing added to each) and furniture in them. The salaries in BF are indeed less than the Rabbayim, but the tuition has to pay for the mortgages of the buildings. The Madison building is a joke, leaking every time it rains, doors missing locks or hinges, floor tiles mixed and matched, floor in dining room sags, classrooms in the basement where the swimming pool used to be, etc.
Please! The loshon hora that BF tuition pays for the Cheder is just not true. The Madison building is rent-free, and the James building is very cheaply rented. So there is enough money from the tuition to pay the salaries. And for the girls, the bulk of the money goes toward the buildings, and that's why they sometimes got paid later.
TP#11: What are you afraid of? It's pretty clear to all of us.
TP#14: What a joke. Can you imagine these people calling BF principals nirdofim?? And what, exactly, would you call RBM if not a nirdof? And who did the redifa that cost him the school that he single-handedly built up?
Sickening.
to afraid to sign my name,
get your facts straight!!
your points are LIE after LIE your talking points are sheker the vaad never was rodef RBM don't play victim with him now .
yes the madison building is a joke,where was the incomptent vaad all along to get the LCS a new building ?where was RBM?
there are no motgages on the buildings they are loans tbhat were taken out on the buildings to pay salaries etc... instead of fundraising ,no dinner no parlor meetings, nada look at all other mosdos how they shvitz to build buildings and raise funds.
To 8:04- you think RBM did a bad job he put his heart and soul into this school.Just wait until this new vaad haKaspi takes over lets see if they could meet payroll.
One thing I can assure you as soon as Yeshiva takes over tuition wiil go up salaries will get cut. You will be begging RBM to come back.
You forgot TP#13 - va'ad obligates itself to pay the debts of the "NEW" Bais Faiga, debts that other people incurred over the objections of the va'ad!?!
No mortgages? None at all?? You get your facts straight!
the yeshiva did not take over,its back at the hands of the vaad hakaspi and no doubt they will have to raise tuition there is millions in debt from a lack af fundraising and not being able to payback loans sooner or later it catches up to you.
Afraid to sign was right on most points.
RBM was a nirdaf, all right, but your're right, not from the Vaad. The Vaad backed him completely. It was others (ahem, ahem) who were roidef him. This is common knowledge.
Secondly, where was the Vaad and RBM when it came to getting a new building? FYI, the cheder owns two tracts of land where they were supposed to build. One, on Prosepct Street, was to be divided and sold to fund the building of a new state of the art building. And then THE SAME PEOPLE WHO WERE ROIDEF HIM above blocked the township's approval to divide and sell.
No mortgages? Do you think that the Cheder paid cash for those buildings? This is an ignorant comment.
As far as dinners, I taka don't know why they don't have one. They do have a chinese auction that they had to skip this year bec. of all the machlokes.
not true ,look in the dictionary what nirdaf means, RBM was not a nirdaf...they RY felt that its time to change directions and have him leave the institution that's not called being a nirdaf
most of the buildingd and land came from donations by gevirim ie. kuperman and previous campaigns the mortgages are a small detail and are loans that where taken not for the buildings but against the buildings
as far as the land there was a lot of private investments involved not in the intrest of the cheder which prevented it from going forward.
BM was most definitely a nirdaf in every sense of the word
Elokim yevakesh es nirdaf
The foul langaguge used to describe him at very high levels was absolutely shocking and has been going on since before this even broke (before the strike)
This topic has generated a great number of comments, many too vitriolic to publish. We remind you not to use this forum for Loshon Hara, to poke fun at others or for posting hateful comments. Those will not get posted. If you would like to disagree with others' facts or views, please try to do so in a respectful and tasteful manner. This will (a) get you published, and (b) probably gain more favorable consideration for your viewpoint. Thank you for understanding and cooperating.
I guess those of us who were naive enough to believe this was a machlokes lshem shomayim have been enlightened . Nebach on all of us
I B"H have little or no knowledge about this Machlokes and intend to keep it that way.
What I DO know is that the horrendous Loshon Horoh mailings I am getting are absolutely SICKENING!
There are not enough curses and onshim in the Torah for the despicable people who are putting them out.
To those of you who have infected my mailbox these so many times: may Hashem visit on you all the things coming to you.
Lastly, you have succeeded in getting me to pick a side, and its not yours.
While i have no clue who is sending out those mailings ,it reads and sounds like the work of one disgruntled ,bored person .Of course it is despicable but I wouldnt take any sides just because one person with a word processor and a few dollars for stamps decided to get nasty .
if you have no knowledge, how can you be making an informed decision?
if you intend to keep it that way, why are you reading this blog?
if you don't know the details, how can you pasken? sometimes such things are mutar.
once the new person takes over, he'll nevr be able to keep up with the evergrowing budget. it happened with another school this year. the administration left and the school hired someone new. the old administration was always on time with payroll and never bounced a check in six years. i wish i could say the same for the new administration. people think the grass is always greener on the other side. i heard from many people that they wish the old administration would come back.
Chazal in Yalkut Beshalach 268 tell a mashal of someone who found an expensive aveida, rode into town declaring it, thus deceiving the townfolk that he is a "tzadik and a chassid". Impressed, they appointed him their chief.
Within 3 years he destroyed the entire city.
Similiarly, Yeravam ben Nevat gained the confidence of kllal yisroel, by offering mussar to Shlomo Hamelech for oversleeping. With this ploy, he gained malchus over 10 Shevatim, subsequently destroying them by misleading them into avoda zara and galus.
In Sota 9b, Chazal further teach us what happens to someone who "steals the heart of kllal yisroel", (gneivas daas), as did Avshalom.
We ignore these lessons at our own peril, vd"l.
To vd"l:
Are you referring to those who pretend to be so deeply concerned about 3 girls out of school, so that they can use that "credibility" to destroy schools with 4,000, without compunction?
or,
Are you referring to those who are gonev daas hatzibur by giving them a false sense of security that its the parents school, only so they can steal it out from under them in broad daylight?
Or both??
Please be less cryptic for those of us who are not mayvinim.
I think what he's reffring to is the Kanaim who send out mailings of lashon hora and rechilus ,and motzie shem ra, the kanaim who openly are mevazeh our roshei yeshiva and talmidei chachamim,the kanoim who belittle our gedolim all for the sake of keeping our shtut heilig for the sake of kvod shamayim.
"To those of you who have infected my mailbox these so many times: may Hashem visit on you all the things coming to you"
excuse me how can a frum yid talk like that.We always say even if someone does us harm we would never want harm to befall them because of us!How can you talk like that! I belive that you should give everyone a bracha!
It is an aveira to wish harm upon any ben yisroel
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